Author Topic: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"  (Read 11931 times)

Phil

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Re: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"
« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2008, 10:21:39 PM »
Telstar1957

The thing is we could all pick faults with any city in the world. There are certainly some cities in England that I could pick out faults with their choice of architecture. Where the sense in that though, saying that I don't like and that I think it is ugly doesn't make it so. Somebody else probably would think it a work of art.

I would be the first to admit that Birmingham has made mistakes, but I would as quickly say at least it tries. After WWII Birmingham was one of the first, if not the first to start the reconstruction of its City.

Can you name me another major city that has reconstructed its city centre and infrastructure twice since 1945. And as much as we slag off Birmingham's 60's Bull Ring, when first constructed it was greeted by all of England as a success and the way forward. How many other cities in England are now encircled by a ring road copying Birmingham's idea.

Phil
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Telstar

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Re: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"
« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2008, 11:41:21 PM »
Hi tramp, acts of wanton, reckless vandalism have been inflicted on Birmingham since the war. Old people used to say that the town hall planners had inflicted more damage on the city than The Luftwaffe and if you do a little research you'll see it's true.... You're right about the bullets, Tramp?

Though I think it would be too good for them.....
The truth always prevails.....

roy one

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Re: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"
« Reply #13 on: October 20, 2008, 11:53:39 PM »
hi telstar sorry if i did not say welcome to the b/forum i do not know how old you are but tramp and Phil and my self used to play on the bombing and just around the center there was a lot of bomb buildings  but you may be right about the planners iv seen three faces of the bullring going back to the late 40s and 50s
each day is a blessing and I bless each day when it comes

Telstar

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Re: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2008, 12:55:51 AM »
Hi phil, I'd like to thank you for being the first to welcome me to the Birmingham Forum. You're right, it is a great site and I can see that people like yourself and all the other adult children that frequent it, make it so. All the Peter Pan's and Wendy's are a breath of fresh air.....

Anyway! The reason our city has needed to be reconstructed twice is because they got it wrong the last time. A lot of the blocks and social housing has been flattend because they were a disaster? Attwood Green is the latest prime example of the Phoenix?

The not so innovative Inner Ring Road or concrete coller, that they have started to dismantle, starting with Masshouse Circus, Moorstreet Queensway and St Martin's Circus, including the Bull Ring were taken down because they didn't work. They was all costly mistakes.

The amount of beautiful architecture that was lost to progress is incalculable. Did you know that Colmore Row was also to go with a road through the middle to link the concrete coller? I have seen the plans. But enough was enough at the time and it escaped by the skin of it's teeth. There would have been no city left. The concrete coller shrunk the size of Birmingham city centre and excluded everything outside of it, cut off the oxygen to it and it died a slow, painful death. The city centre became smaller?

The responsibility of all this lay with mainly just one man, The City Engineer, Herbert Manzoni. He was the driving force from the late 1950's and early 60's to push the concrete coller through, without any regard for the history, historic streetscapes and architecture that has been lost forever. His grand plan was to give the city over to the motorcar, now it's break the collar and expand the city for the pedestrian.

They have been filling in all the subways and taking down the coller because what went before doesn't work. His legacy is now being dismantled, but he dismantled our heritage that was by and large a beautiful Victorian city. Those custodians and Merchants and city forefathers, true lovers of Birmingham, the Louisa Anne Rylands of their world that went before, I read your article, and passed it on to the Herbert Manzonis and his ilk of our world, must be spinning in their graves......

Everything I said about The Bull Ring, The Bunker and and that other bunker, New St Station, is true, and what they replaced all the things in our city with was not an improvement and the same goes the second time round too.... They are not an improvement. Whatever happened to.... " If it ain't broke don't fix it..... " Anyway phil, let's lighten up.... It's only a bit of oul craic....

The truth always prevails.....

Telstar

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Re: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"
« Reply #15 on: October 21, 2008, 01:04:25 AM »
Thanks, roy ben! I'm only a chisler compared to some or maybe most of you.... It is a great site and I have spent sometime on it since I was introduced to it from someone from friendsreunited. I've enjoyed reading the banter between the Peter Pan's and Wendy's.... The children that are forever young at heart.... Long may you all live.......
The truth always prevails.....

tramp

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Re: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"
« Reply #16 on: October 21, 2008, 03:33:49 AM »
Telstar,

Let me apologise for earlier replying to one of your posts without welcoming you, and do so now, while adding that I hope that you will continue to contribute as firmly and clearly as you now are.  Some of us are a serious and lighthearted group of daft moaners who all want the best for brum - many have their own thoughts of what's best - I don't, as I never saw the 60s redevelopment nor do I live in UK.  Accordingly, I only post about what remains of, and what has been destroyed since 1959, of the brum I knew.  Certainly, great change was needed to what remained of pre-war slums etc, and obviously their was a massive need for reconstruction  - anyone who doubts this should view the two city maps with the location of every known bomb which Phil has posted - it looks far worse than any secondhand dartboard.

Telstar

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Re: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"
« Reply #17 on: October 21, 2008, 11:43:12 AM »
Thank you tramp. I will find phils WW2 bomb damage maps and take a look. I've only been looking on the forum the last three days and am now only getting a feel for it. The only thing is it's easy to get carried away and the clock doesn't stand still. It's now 11.30 am and as they say......

" There's not a child in the house washed! "

Being self employed since I was a kid, leaves me plenty of flexible time.... But I have to crack the whip and shake a leg every now and then, or I'll be have to let myself go....

It is a great website and I'm sure I'll be back later this evening to have a butchers and maybe respond to something..... By the way tramp, I think the reason you all moan is not because you are a bunch of moaners, it's because writing something, expressing your thoughts and sharing them with others, can have a very therapeutical effect on sender and receiver, whether they agree or not. Sharing is caring and from what I've read on some of the topics, there are a lot of sharing and caring people over there.... The place may have changed but the people haven't......

Anyway, best go or I'll be late!
The truth always prevails.....

john2000

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Re: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"
« Reply #18 on: October 21, 2008, 12:15:04 PM »
Two maps bomb damage,? I didn't see that map, tell me where it is, so I can see if my house was bombed, what happened to Pebble Mill ( BBC), all I see now is large flat ground of open space,? ( shame that I put a lot of work into that building,back in the 60's).. I wonder if that enormous Elk is still in the museum across the road in Canon Hill park.? and I see the paddling pool has gone, used to play there a lot ( the water was only 12"deep, ), ....J2... :(
Growing old is mandatory..........Growing up is optional

surg

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Re: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"
« Reply #19 on: October 21, 2008, 12:53:52 PM »
I don't know if Birmingham is the ugliest city in the country and I would like to see more detail as to how this survey was carried out.
The question I would ask to everyone on this forum is that if the survey was found to be an accurate and indepth survey then how would you like to see your city improved to bring it up to the higher living environments of other cities?

tramp

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Re: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"
« Reply #20 on: October 21, 2008, 01:57:05 PM »
John and Telstar,

Go back through just Phil's past posts, and you'll find the bomb maps.

John, it's more a matter of finding anything that wasn't bombed e.g. New St, between Colmore Row and High St, was stuck by over 20 bombs.

surg

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Re: BBC and Birmingham's "ugly buildings"
« Reply #21 on: October 21, 2008, 02:15:36 PM »
John and Telstar,

Go back through just Phil's past posts, and you'll find the bomb maps.

John, it's more a matter of finding anything that wasn't bombed e.g. New St, between Colmore Row and High St, was stuck by over 20 bombs.

Do you think Birmingham would be a better place if they'd done what they did in Dresden and rebuilt it almost exactly the same as it was before it was bombed?